Huh, this kind of makes sense, but I did dislike the INPO inspections as mush or maybe more than the NRC special inspections. We would bend over backwards to please INPO, but we would fight the NRC when it was justified.
Perceptive point. In a balanced system, there always has to be a way to push back against a regulator that is being unreasonable. INPO, like NRC, is a monopoly. I am NOT advocating replacing NRC with INPO. I am pointing out we don't need a government controlled regulator to achieve effective regulation. But we do need a system that has a balancing mechanism.
In Underwriter Certification, if the inspector really is being unreasonable, you can go to a different inspection service as long as it's acceptable to your insurers. The inspector knows that. So he has to be reasonable or he loses a customer. He has to find the sweet spot that is acceptable to the insurers but is not so unreasonable that you can find another inspector who is more reasonable and is also acceptable to your underwriters.
If you think about it, this system invented in the 17th century is quite ingenious.
It assumes humans are selfish. But if true competition is maintained, which is government's job, the system will balance harm (in this case, cancer incidence from a release) against all the manifold benefits of nuclear power.
The NRC system assumes our bureaucrats are saints. These people are so perfect that they will risk their career and their family's income in order to approve a cheap nuclear power plant because of all the benefits to the consumers of that electricity.
Amazingly history tells us such people exist. Many ended up as martyrs, and we revere them. But they are extremely rare. Neither you nor I qualify. And I will give you very long odds that none of them are employees of the NRC or INPO.
The NRC need# to be radically changed,by doing away with ALARA, which starts with discarding the LNT narrative. This two falsehoods about radiation hazards need to be removed from our regulatory framework.
You are not listening, ALARA is just a symptom, not a cause. Getting rid of LNT is necessary but not sufficient, The NRC does not need to be radically changed. Humans cant be radically changed. NRC apparatchiks are not going to have an epiphany and become saints. The NRC must be expunged. Trump needs to take his wrecking ball to Rockville. Unfortunately, won't happen when the wrecking ball is a battery salesman, who claimed he could power the US with solar from a corner of what New Mexico?
I’m not sure why you’re getting upset at me. Have you ever worked at a nuclear plant? Did you wear a dosimeter to work every day? Have you been interviewed by an NRC inspector? Have you argued with an NRC consultant about the adequacy of your electrical plant?
I know what it’s like to work with federal regulators. I did it for over 30 years.
Jack, no specifics, but it applies generally all the way back at early INPO (it was in a book written about the early history of INPO (can't find it now). It's no secret there were lots of plants that just didn't "get it"; that their NPP wasn't just "another power plant". The early INPO leaders were all high up in large organizations. They understood dysfunctional organizations, and they knew how to fix them. If early INPO inspections, and pointing out needed changes, with no results etc. just weren't soaking in because they were too embedded in the organization, they knew what to do... get the CEO fired (and they did a couple) and tell them INPO will cancel their INPO certification if they don't. You know what that meant... they'd loose their insurance. The utilities own a part of the insurance company. It worked because all the other Boards of Directors understood they were all in together, and a threat by one was a threat to all. So those utilities were on board with the INPO position too.
Huh, this kind of makes sense, but I did dislike the INPO inspections as mush or maybe more than the NRC special inspections. We would bend over backwards to please INPO, but we would fight the NRC when it was justified.
Ken,
Perceptive point. In a balanced system, there always has to be a way to push back against a regulator that is being unreasonable. INPO, like NRC, is a monopoly. I am NOT advocating replacing NRC with INPO. I am pointing out we don't need a government controlled regulator to achieve effective regulation. But we do need a system that has a balancing mechanism.
In Underwriter Certification, if the inspector really is being unreasonable, you can go to a different inspection service as long as it's acceptable to your insurers. The inspector knows that. So he has to be reasonable or he loses a customer. He has to find the sweet spot that is acceptable to the insurers but is not so unreasonable that you can find another inspector who is more reasonable and is also acceptable to your underwriters.
If you think about it, this system invented in the 17th century is quite ingenious.
It assumes humans are selfish. But if true competition is maintained, which is government's job, the system will balance harm (in this case, cancer incidence from a release) against all the manifold benefits of nuclear power.
The NRC system assumes our bureaucrats are saints. These people are so perfect that they will risk their career and their family's income in order to approve a cheap nuclear power plant because of all the benefits to the consumers of that electricity.
Amazingly history tells us such people exist. Many ended up as martyrs, and we revere them. But they are extremely rare. Neither you nor I qualify. And I will give you very long odds that none of them are employees of the NRC or INPO.
The NRC need# to be radically changed,by doing away with ALARA, which starts with discarding the LNT narrative. This two falsehoods about radiation hazards need to be removed from our regulatory framework.
Ken,
You are not listening, ALARA is just a symptom, not a cause. Getting rid of LNT is necessary but not sufficient, The NRC does not need to be radically changed. Humans cant be radically changed. NRC apparatchiks are not going to have an epiphany and become saints. The NRC must be expunged. Trump needs to take his wrecking ball to Rockville. Unfortunately, won't happen when the wrecking ball is a battery salesman, who claimed he could power the US with solar from a corner of what New Mexico?
Fine, gut the NRC, I don’t care.
I’m not sure why you’re getting upset at me. Have you ever worked at a nuclear plant? Did you wear a dosimeter to work every day? Have you been interviewed by an NRC inspector? Have you argued with an NRC consultant about the adequacy of your electrical plant?
I know what it’s like to work with federal regulators. I did it for over 30 years.
Ken,
The choir and I would love to hear some of your war stories. Why not send me a guest post?
Sure, give me a couple of days. Thanks
Done. I just posted about Working with NRC inspectors.
https://open.substack.com/pub/kennethkaminski/p/working-with-nrc-inspectors?r=b354y&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=web
Everybody should check it out.
Ken,
How much of the paperwork could be eliminated without materially affecting the probability of a release?
INPO helped turn around Palo Verde/ a big help.
Anthony,
Could you give us some specifics?
Jack, no specifics, but it applies generally all the way back at early INPO (it was in a book written about the early history of INPO (can't find it now). It's no secret there were lots of plants that just didn't "get it"; that their NPP wasn't just "another power plant". The early INPO leaders were all high up in large organizations. They understood dysfunctional organizations, and they knew how to fix them. If early INPO inspections, and pointing out needed changes, with no results etc. just weren't soaking in because they were too embedded in the organization, they knew what to do... get the CEO fired (and they did a couple) and tell them INPO will cancel their INPO certification if they don't. You know what that meant... they'd loose their insurance. The utilities own a part of the insurance company. It worked because all the other Boards of Directors understood they were all in together, and a threat by one was a threat to all. So those utilities were on board with the INPO position too.